Thursday, February 11, 2010

What's with the smart bochurim these days?

The whole story with the Yid who is sentenced to get killed, nebach, R"L, HYL"S, is terrible, and I daven for Hashem to have rachmanus on him.
The issue has come up in my yeshiva about whether or not the government killing him is going against Halacha.
Two extremely smart bochurim have made it clear to me that the halacha of Dina D'Malchusa Dina does not apply when it goes against Torah. Does it go against Torah to kill a goy? No, so the government can enact a law saying you are not allowed to kill someone. If the government says that if you kill someone, you could be killed yourself, does this go against Torah? Yes. According to Halacha, a Jew does not get killed for killing a goy. Therefore, Since the government says he could be killed, this is going against the Torah, and any time the Dina D'malchusa goes against Torah, it does not apply.

No matter how much I tried to argue with them, they were set in their minds on how they defined the parameters of Dina D'malchusa Dina.

I wanted to be sure, myself, instead of just assuming my opinion was correct, and I spoke to some knowledgeable Rabbinic figures. I am correct. Of course the government can decide to enact laws, and follow through with whatever punishments they see fit. As long as the law itself does not make you go against Torah, that is. If you don't say this, than any punishment of the government for sure does not follow to detail the Jewish Laws about Eidim and Beis Din and so forth.

I just get on edge when people start making up their own Torah, and believing they are correct, without consulting someone.

Now, in our case with the poor Yid, obviously we want the government to remove the death sentence, for even in the government's own laws, a person deserves a fair trial and fair punishment, etc.
But it is incorrect to say that if the government does chas v'shalom go ahead and mete out the death penalty, this is going against Halacha.

Also about smart bochurim not being so smart, there is a bochur in the mesivta in Los Angeles who is exceptionally gifted. He is incredibly bright and fanatically (in a good way) chassidish; one of the top bochurim in the Yeshiva. He was asking again and again over Yud Shvat when he was here, for me to be his mashpia.
For a smart kid, what a foolish request.


*Okay, so one of the bochurim with whom I was speaking told me he looked up the inyan of Dina D'malchusa in the Talmudic Encyclopedia. He says that the laws of Dina... only apply for Diney Mammanus. Meaning monetary transgressions, not for Diney Nefashos: capital crimes.
This Svara makes a lot more sense. This I can swallow. His first Boich Svara of Dina D'malchusa not applying for the punishments, since they don't match Torah, which therefore goes against Torah, wasn't so easy to accept. Anyway, I was glad to see that this bochur realized to ask the rabannim and do some research. Definitely a smarter mode of travel. Or wiser. Whichever.
We're still finding out if this chiluk of nefashos/mammon is correct.